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Here's the second half of the hit posted by:
Richard Vance Carson
LIS Student getting Media Coordinator certification
University of North Carolina at Greensboro
zyg@worldnet.att.net
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You ask a BIG question!  I don't think that there is a
"global" answer for this question.  Depending on your
school, how the program is set up (i.e. flexible, rigid,
teacher-directed, librarian-directed, teacher/librarian
directed, study hall (God forbid!); your school "culture,"
and other variables I can't even begin to imagine, the
answer will vary.
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  My advice would be to start out tough.  It is much easier
to relax the
rules later than it is to toughen up on the rules later.
  Someone posted a hit on a similar line about a week or two
ago.  I think it was called "The First Day of School" or
something like that.  Check the archives.
  Good luck.
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My teachers do come to the library with their classes.  When
I do
orientation, I tell the classes (with teacher
present)-"Remember, this is still Ms/Mrs/Mr  Name's class,
it is simply meeting in a different
location."  " I'm sure your teacher will expect you to
follow the same
rules here that you do in class."  " I am here to help your
teacher, not to replace them."  " Think of me as your guest
speaker."  etc.

Hope this helps.....
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I know that they are telling you in Library School all about
the
wonders of teamwork and co-operative teaching of thematic
units.  But for most of us in the real world it is not
happening yet.  Most of the time that you have students in
the LMC, YOU are THE teacher.  Students get to go to the
library just like they get to go to Art, Music, and PE.  The
teacher brings them to your door, leaves for her "prep
time," and comes back at the end of the period (You hope,
before the next class arrives).  If you have not had a
course in classroom management yet you better get one soon.
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Please post a hit!
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I have been a LMS for 12 years.  I believe that we must take
responsibility for discipline if we want the students to
respect us and think of us as teachers.  I have the rules
posted and they are general.  I have time out seats, keep
kids in for recess and occassionally contact parents.  If a
child stays in for recess he or she has a paper to complete
briefly stating why they are in and how they will change
their behavior.  I don't speak over kids voices, I wait for
quiet and find that the kids tell each other to shut up.  Be
firm and consistant, start each class fresh, let the kids
know you like them, but that you expect them to be
respectful.
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You will probably get loads of feedback on this
one....

I found my first year that you need to take a
very firm line from the beginning. Tell them the
rules, the expectations and the consequences and
then make sure you stand by them. After a month
or so, you can back off a bit. But it is much
easier to start out strict and back up then be
too soft and get stricter.

You also need to act as if the room was yours -
which it is. When you are in front of the class,
you are in charge of discipline whether the
teacher is there or not. You'll never get control
of the group if they keep looking to the teacher
for punishment. Its a little like when you were a
kid and you had to "just wait til your father
gets home!" No one was afraid of mom but boy
watch out for dad! Most teachers just sort of
kick back while you are teaching and then
helpselect books. Discipline and reward are your
job.

Good luck!
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Richard - At the elementary level: Make your lessons
interesting and hands on as much as possible.  Don't
tolerate misbehavior.  Have clear cut rules, stressed at
beginning of year, maybe even posted in the library.  I
think LMS is in charge of discipline in the library.  It's
his/her turf and he/she should set the limits.  I only ask a
teacher to help in extreme circumstances.  I sometimes
consult with a teacher if the same student continues to have
problems, and we come up with a plan together. Consequences
- misbehavior during checkout means the student leaves the
center for the rest of the day.  Misbehavior during class
means the student is works by him/herself, away from
others.  Generally, kids like the library and usually behave
fairly well.  If students in a particular class tend to have
problems, I sometimes use a seating chart rather than
letting them sit by friends.
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When a teacher is in the media center with the class, I
expect the
teacher to handle discipline.  I will tell the teacher when
I see
something or hear something inappropriate.  If the teacher
doesn't do
anything (rarely happens), I step in or I suggest that
perhaps it's time
for the class to leave (that usually gets action from a
reluctant
teacher).
  Teachers are always with the classes except for the
classes that have
library periods during teacher preps.
  Hope this helps.
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Generally I speak to the teacher and say things like "In
case you didn't
see...." or "I thought you might like to know..."  when it
involves goofy behaviour.  If the teacher isn't there I send
them back to class and call the teacher. When it comes to
computer infractions I get directly involved because the
teacher may not realize what they're up to.  For plagiarism
concerns I speak to the student and the teacher.  In other
words there is no magic answer that can offer.

As you get to know the staff better you will be better able
to judge how
they would best like things to work.  I know who is
comfortable with my
direct relations with "their" kids and who gets defensive.

Different people have different levels of tolerance for
things like messes and noise level.  When the noise is
driving me nuts or I am going to get stuck with the mess I
speak up - loud and clear.

I hope my next comment isn't terrible.  There are some
groups that I dread and just slog through it, because I know
that the teacher isn't going to do much about anything.
Sorry, but I don't know how to put this reality nicely.
Sometimes I have to leave for awhile and come back after a
bit of time spent elsewhere.  This is quite easy to do
because I have lots of things going on with people in
classrooms.  I don't have to feel too guilty because I am
still doing my job, but I still do.  Thankfully it is quite
rarely that I "escape" to other work.
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Richard:  I jumped into the Media Spec. role with no
previous teaching
educ. or experience.  ( I earned my cert. by alternate
route, which was no easy task).  This is also my biggest
problem.  The school I was in and my new school (I start
next week) use library as a teacher's prep, which means I'm
the only teacher at that time.  I have tried using a point
system for good behavior, using my lunch pd. and their
recess as punishment, but one of the most effective methods
is simply separating them to a single table away from the
group.  I would be interested in hearing what other say on
this.
Please post a hit.  Thanks!
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Media center discipline, like all discipline, depends partly
on school
climate and policies.  In a school where teachers accompany
classes to
media center, you can expect teachers to help manage
students, but you'll need to set tone. You'll also need to
establish your rules and procedures, then communicate them
to teachers and students.  I highly recommend Harry Wong's
_First Days of School_ to help you think through essential
rules and procedures.
For example, one of my rules is, "Engage in productive
activity."  (I have grades 5-12.)  During our orientation
discussion, my fifth graders help me generate a list of
"productive activities" -- reading magazines, studying,
using computers, seeking books, researching, etc. -- and a
list of "unproductive activities" -- talking, running around
shelves, walking around with nothing to do, sleeping,
staring into space.  We also discuss consequences:
suggestion that student find a magazine to read or another
productive activity, instruction to move to another table
away from social group, instruction to return to class
immediately.
Not exactly what you asked for, but maybe it'll help.
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If a student is misbehaving in my library, I ask him/her to
leave.  If the behavior is really obnoxious, I send a note
to the teacher asking not to send the student back
unaccompanied by the teacher for a certain period of time,
depending upon the offense.  Works for me!
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Is the teacher is the room also? (It can be a little tricky
when the class is with a teacher.) Otherwise, it's your area
& your rules apply. If they don't behave, they don't stay.
Simple, easy.
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This is my fifth year as a LMS at the middle school level
and I must say
that it definitly depends on the particular situation. What
I do is have
an orientation at the benning of the school year by having
all the English classes come in to hear my speech. This
includes my expectations for what the students behavior is
when they come in. If I know that the group is a
particularly tough one I will talk to them before they are
released to doing their research. If you are colaborating
with the teacher on a unit you can talk with them about any
concerns that you have. Just remewmber that the library is
your responsibilty, if it is left a mess then it is you that
will be judged about what it looks like.
Good luck, it is a wonderful job.
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We use Lee Canter's Assertive Discipline Program in  our
district.  In
fact, one of my previous principals retired and is now
working with Lee
giving workshops to district teachers & parents across the
country.
Canter has written numerous books and teacher guides, some
with his wife
as author or co-author.  They would be very helpful for you
as a
student.
With assertive discipline, each teacher, including the Media
specialist,
decides on up to 6 classroom expectations, and  rewards and
consequences
for positive and negative behavior.  These are listed and
discussed at
the beginning of school and reinforced consistently
throughout the year.
When working with teachers who accompany their classes, both
teachers
can and do reinforce this system.  Since we all do it, most
classroom
expected behaviors are the same; I address my classroom and
specific
media behaviors, and where appropriate and not obtrusive,
the teacher
does the same.  We work as a team to provide the best
educational
experiences for our children.
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8/25/99
Yoruba Proverb:  The child who is not afraid of anybody will
develop bad
manners.

Dear Richard,

A teacher who can manage her classroom will earn the respect
of her
students and they will manage themselves.

Clearly state what you will and will not accept, (one
teacher who wanted to bring her class to the library told me
she intended to bring the class to the library and "turn
them loose."  She said she didn't know what my expectations
were... I told her they were the same as they were in her
own H. S. Library...she was in her late 40's).  I then went
over the rules and regulations with her, ( she had joined
the staff mid-quarter). An institution usually has a code of
rules defining socially accepted behavior whether it is a
school library, a courtroom, or a church.   Use of the Media
Center is a privilege, not a right, socially acceptable
behavior is expected at all times.

When teachers sign up for library periods they are reminded
that they are responsible for classroom management.

All school rules are enforced in the library.  I ask
teachers to review
library rules and regulations before they bring a class to
the library.

At the beginning of the session, if a student forgets the
school or library rules of common civility, I usually
quietly  point it out to the teacher. Later in the session,
I'd probably handle the situation myself.

I've had to suggest to a teacher with poor classroom
management skills that students could be sent to the library
individually until the class could behave with more respect
for themselves and consideration for others while in the
library.  ( Some of the students were climbing on the desk
and throwing papers and completely ignored their teacher's
admonitions and threats)!

Insist the students and teacher respect both themselves and
the rights of others.
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Dear Richard: Please share with lerkers any info you get on
this one.  I
am also new and would like input on the same subject.
Thanks.
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This is an interesting question. Usually not addressed
in Library Media Courses. But of real world
consequence to practicing media specialists.

I have been a Media Spec. for 9 years before that I
spent a year as a Children's Librarian. I was trained
as a Media Spec. It would have been a rude awakening
to have been a Children's Librarian and then get a job
as a Media Coordinator. In flexible scheduled Media
Centers, it is usually not as much as a problem
because the teacher remains with her class.

I was in a K-5 school in SC and the K-2 were sceduled
every week, 3-5 were flex. Now, I'm in a k-5 school in
NC and I'm totally fixed. I'm a planning period for
teachers.

My rules are the following:

Enter quietly, begin work.
Do not disturb others.
Take care of all materials.
Return all materials when you are finished with them.

I got these rules from Becky Bridges 11 years ago. She
is a Media Spec. in SC, Anderson District 1. She got
them from Eleanor Haton who is also a Media Spec, also
in SC, Spartanburg district, she has been teaching for
over 30 years. These rules can be used in a K-12
setting.

My conseqences are
1. Warning
2. Removal from group
3. Return to classroom or office.
I really can't return anyone to their classroom
because I am their planning period.

I go over the rules the first few weeks of school. I
have to be really tough and their are classes that I
don't accomplish much with since I have to spend all
my time doing the discipline thing. In the past 2
years, I've had some really tough classes, we used to
have 6th grade. This year I'll only have one really
tough class and I am so thankful!! BEH, behavior -
emotionally handicapped students are mainstreamed so
those classes with BEH students can be a real
challenge.

I have K-3 for "library" and 4-5 I teach keyboarding,
etc.

Please let me know if you have any other questions or
if I can help you in any way.
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Thanks to one and all for your input on this question. The
various perspectives have been very helfpful to me. Thanks!

Richard Vance Carson
LIS Student getting Media Coordinator certification
University of North Carolina at Greensboro
zyg@worldnet.att.net

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