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Here is even more on the subject... Kimberly Rose Library Media Specialist Star Lake Elementary Kent, WA Federal Way S.D. krose@fwsd.wednet.edu ************************************* Do not do this if you work any after school. The room will be so noisy and you will constantly be cleaning up the mess from the group. Oh, sure they'll say they will clean up, but believe me, the books will be taken out of place, and I've had cereal ground in the carpet. I get children of parents on committees after school that the parents don't even ask or have anything for them to do. It's Mrs. Hodges won't mind if they sit quietly and do nothing. Yesterday, I left before I had planned because I was not able to concentrate. ************************************* Stick to your guns, Kimberly! No way! Not unless you want to pick up after them every time you come to work. My reason was that there are too many expensive items in the library, and my principal backed me. Good luck! ************************************* Kimberly, your initial reaction was correct. No way should there be child care in the library at any time. My principal backs me up on this. In fact, he does not allow any activities before or after school in the library that are not school sponsored. Besides the obvious problem of potential damage to books, wear on furniture, etc., there is this question: how in the world would you get any work done? The kids will be noisy, and believe me, they will be interrupting you every other minute to help them find or do something, no matter how many times the adults in charge tell them that you are not to be bothered. Also, child care by nature can (and should) allow for a lot of running around, movement, and noise! If kids think they can do that in the library before and after school, they will also think they can do it in the library during the school day. Not a good message to be sending. Our YMCA child care program takes place in the all-purpose room (cafeteria). It has worked well there for many years. I hope your school will be able to find a better place than the library! Good luck! ************************************* Kimberly, Our before school program is in the gym. The after-school program uses the cafeteria, playground and the library. The library is used for study hall only. You have to make sure that someone responsible is in charge. We've had high school kids supervising the students before, and they tend to do their own work and not watch the students closely. The other librarian and I do not work during the after school program. We do not allow the students to use the books after school, because we had trouble with kids pulling books off the shelf and leaving them lying around the library. It was frustrating to have to come in first thing in the morning and straighten up the library when I had left it neat the night before. They may only use the computers if they have permission from their teacher. I would not want the entire program to be in here. The kids have snack and do crafts in the cafeteria, so we do not have to deal with those messes. ************************************* I hope that you can keep this from happening! We did have after school care in our library until this year. The library is just not a place for this. The students had to keep quiet because there were other students in the library. Also, since food is not allowed, the after school kids could not have snack. For these children, this was just an extension of a school day. After school care is now in the cafeteria. The kids just love it because they can eat and talk. They are not limited to doing schoolwork. If they need to come the library, the moderator gives them a pass. Hope this helps! ************************************* Having run one of those before and after school care programs I would STRONGLY advise that you refuse to allow them to use your space. Oftentimes the people running those programs are very young - 18 - 20, and really have very little control of the kids. They also have snacks - which may end up all over the floor - and the kids like to run and play. They gym would make more since. We actually used a classroom which was used only for special events because it was an extra large room where they could have presentations and stuff. We had a pretty large stash of games and toys, and we took the kids outside every day for at least an hour of the three hours that we had them. It would have been great if we could have taken the kids to the library every now and then for a story or even to check out books - but I worked at a school where the media center was only open two days per week - and then only from 9-11 am. So the librarian was never available for this service. At any rate, I don't mean to ramble, but I wouldn't want the children in there all the time - but if you offered to read them stories every other week or once a month for half an hour - I'm sure that would be greatly appreciated by whoever runs the program. ************************************* Most of what I have seen is not good for child care in the library after school. Usually books are everywhere (sort of a free for all of entertainment), not to mention overflow of "left or lost items." The computers are used for entertainment -- rather than instruction. All used is the printer paper with multiple copies of the same thing due to pressing the print button over and over (I want it NOW!) We have been told to make the library accessable at all times, for as many uses as possible, but this one is on the far end of unacceptable. ************************************* We have that program and I have never had to say "NO WAY!" but I would if someone brought it up. First of all we have all the other staff meetings in the library after school. Secondly before and after school is when teacehrs are coming for materials. If there is a behavior issue you would have to step in, rainy days they would stay longer and more than likely the amoun of students they would try to put in might exceed you fire standard. Our aftercare kids go immediately to the cafteria for snack and then are taken by their group leaders eith to an activity, outside, or to the room their are assigned. Of course the aftercare workers can use any of the library materials or even bring their group for a specific purpose - but general everyday - you would never get a thing done! ************************************* Our school has before/after school care with its own staff. Mornings the students are in the cafeteria. Afternoons they are in classrooms, cafeteria, gym -- where ever space is available. They usually come into the media center for a story or activities. The only problem I have is disappearing pencils and glue and marker marks left on the tables. I give them my after school schedule -- they wait until after 4pm when Storytelling Club meets and when we are open for research. They do not come when faculty meetings or book fairs are scheduled. I wish they would clean up after themselves. Also, the children tend to be wild at times. Other than that I have no real objections -- esp. since I am not in charge and have nothing to do with the program or children. (I do discipline the wild ones occasionally.) ************************************* A number of questions need to be addressed: * What are the time frames? * Who is going to be in charge of the students? * How many students? * Will students be required to sit quietly, will there be any activities? * What about looking at books from the shelves, using computers, etc? * Who will do clean-up? * What about food? Hopefully, none, but we must be realistic, and realize that they may be hungry and a lot of after school programs do provide snacks. My vote would be no, too many problems for the library. Ask about the cafeteria. Years ago I helped with an after school program that we did. I used a small room off the Cafeteria. It was great. We could go in to have a snack and clean up and then back to the room for quiet time. If they started to get restless, which wasn't surprising since it was after a full school day, I had activities planned. We didn't have an early morning plan, per se, but a lot of our students qualified for free breakfasts, so we had a group that would get at school early and met in the Cafeteria. One teacher ( we had two who did this and they rotated weeks) would stay with them until early bell rang when they went to their classrooms. This way we had minimum mess- no worries about supervision. ************************************* Kimberly, Our private school offers a very structured after school program called Prime Time. They do use the library from 4-5 or 5:30 Monday- Thursday. But, they are doing homework or reading. There are 2 to 3 staff people with them, and a librarian stays as well. We juggle our work hours so that we can be there until 5:30. We also open at 7:30 am but it is only 20 minutes before the students go to class. We have a few problems in the afternoon....mostly miscommunication, but it is well worth the serve we provide. ************************************* I would encourage you to think about this one before agreeing. We have morning and afternoon check-out, and students can utilize the library during these times as well to work on homework/do research, etc. However, I wanted to make sure that the library didn't become a drop off spot for parents who wanted free babysitting. A school library, in my opinion, is an amalgam of a public library and a classroom. We, as school librarians, want to instill in our patrons (students, staff, and parents) a lifelong love of reading. We also, however, work to support the local curriculum. If your local public library offers child care, or if you have it in the classroom, that's one thing. But, will you really be fulfilling the mission of your media center by hosting babysitting? The students at my school know that the library is a place where learning goes on all the time. If they want to come in, outside of regular school hours, to continue learning... they are welcomed with open arms. If, however, their intent is to horseplay until someone comes to pick them up, they know that this is not the place for that. They are asked to wait somewhere else. So, before you create extended hours, make sure that you have clearly defined guidelines as to what the purpose of using the library is and what is expected of visitors during this extended period. Talk to your principal about your desire to increase patron access to materials, but be honest and say that this does not mean you are a babysitter. If you decide to utilize extended hours in the library, I strongly encourage you not to call it childcare. Advertise it as extended library hours... because that's what it is. Billed this way, you might be surprised at the number of teachers who will take advantage of these extended times to come in to conference with you and to look at resources. Teachers love coming after the rush of afternoon check-out because they know they'll have my undivided attention to help them find exactly what they are looking for. I can't always promise this during their school conference periods because usually I'm with a class. But, after 4:15, the mad rush of afternoon check-out is over and I really can work with teachers in a really intensive way. If your administration has something different in mind for the childcare program, they should find an alternate place to help them fulfill their vision of childcare. It is not the vision of the library. ************************************* We had the after school program occasionally in the library until I put my foot down. I would come in the morning after and find books with torn pages, books that had been colored/marked in, books on the floor, food spilled on the carpet, books with food stains, etc. I also began to notice quite a few books that were on the computer as in/on-shelf but were missing - I never found any of them. Every time it happened I would either hold the book (marked with a Post-It note on date, damage, etc) or take a picture with my digital camera. I gathered it all up, took it to the principal, and asked her how much more damage was she willing to reimburse me for...they stopped being allowed to come in after one particularly bad morning when I found a stack of brand new books that had been damaged beyond the point of being circulation-quality. Please do what you can to keep it out. The kids are antsy after a long day, the caregivers cannot possibly watch their every move, and the amount of possible damage (and missing items) that can accrue (even on occasional visits like I had) is great. HTH ************************************* WHOA! Ours is held in portables. If they have it in the library, I would make sure there are specific rules. Like...students stay at the tables and NOT be allowed at bookshelves. You can offer baskets of books for each table for reading. I would also expect that your whole library be nice and neat when you come in the next day (chairs back in place etc). Good luck. ************************************* Be prepared to find tables and chairs askew, books out of order, supplies missing or used up without notice, and a very LOUD atmosphere. If you are like me (nd most others out there) and end up working late - there will not be any peace and quiet for you to think. If you are shelving books you will soon find tha the students think you are the one in charge and ask you for EVERYTHING - they want to check books in and out, use the computers, follow you everywhere. That had been my experience in Middle school so I can only imagine the same for you in elementary. ************************************* =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-==-= All postings to LM_NET are protected under copyright law. To quit LM_NET (or set-reset NOMAIL or DIGEST, etc.) send email to: listserv@listserv.syr.edu In the message write EITHER: 1) SIGNOFF LM_NET 2) SET LM_NET NOMAIL or 3) SET LM_NET DIGEST 4) SET LM_NET MAIL * Please allow for confirmation from Listserv. 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