Here's a long post re barcodes and spine labels. Generic barcodes are
fine, but it's nice to have information on them. Spine labels a necessary
piece--well, we all knew that from working in the library with students,
staff, and when shelving books. This seems to be not so much a cataloging
issue as one of practice. Perhaps similar to shelving state books together
rather than by Dewey. Thanks you all for ideas. Some, you will see are
quite humorous. we are never to old to learn new things. Thanks!
Leslie
I would question the group as to what the plan is for teaching students
to be independent users of the library? If students cannot see or read
a spine label, how can they locate a book? Is the group planning on
putting the barcode on the spine? Are they planning on re-labeling all
of the books?
I understand how the barcode can give all of that information... but
this doesn't sound like a Destiny issue to me. We have had Destiny for
years... we still catalog books, we still use barcodes, and we still
have spine labels. Our barcodes can tell us a lot of info, but it
doesn't tell squat to a kid.
I don't think these people work with children on a daily basis
I usually explain to students that the call # on the spine label is like
their house number/street on their home -information about where to find
it - the specific location.
Not all barcodes include all the information you listed. Our barcodes
just have the numerals & symbols of the barcode and the name of the
library.
I agree with you - it's not a cataloging issue - it's a Destiny issue.
Just my .02 --
The OPAC, whatever automation system you use, includes a call number to
use
to locate the book on the library shelves. Without a spine label on the
book
spine how do you identify the call number for correct shelving and for
the
patron to see and locate the book on the shelf? Barcodes are much
larger
than a spine label and cannot be seen when the books are on the shelf.
New
cataloging, or not, a spine label is a means to find or replace a book
on
the shelf.
Really! No spine labels! So when kids try to find a book on the shelf
how do they know they are even in the neighborhood? This idea is not
going to work here. I would love to see the place it does. Maybe I am
missing something.
Hi Leslie,
THanks for replying. I don't think it was you who was unclear at all. :)
I think it's the idea itself that is unclear. If there is a call number
on the barcode which is, let's say, on the back of the book, and nothing
on the spine denoting the call number, then it's quite possible for the
shelver to shelve the book.
But how would one shelf-read? How would anyone find a book from a call
number? And how would one teach anyone, adults or children, to find a
book on the shelf after finding the call number in the catalog?
I just don't get it. Sorry if I'm being dense.
Please use without attribution in a hit.
Rational is that if you have to replace the barcode it is easier to just
stick a generic barcode on the book. If you had a printer that would
print I barcode at a time may be. But I have not found desk printer
for individual barcodes that does not use thermal paper.
My very large district (311 schools) uses Destiny and has for the last 6
years. We still have spine labels, we still need spine labels. Spine
labels are to 1) help the patron locate the book on the shelf, and 2) to
aid the library staff reshelving the items on the shelf. Even in
Destiny, the copy information area asks for a call number. This number
appears when the title details are accessed. How would a student know
where to look without the number? How would a student find that number
on a book on the shelf if ia spine label was not there? Can you imagine
students trying to pull books out far enough to see if a call number was
on the barcode? I can't.
Perhaps at the meeting they meant that the barcode needed to be
streamlined and no longer needed the call number printed on it??
BTW, I taught cataloging at UNLV for ten years.
Whoever came up with the idea that spine labels aren't needed must not
use a library very often. I've got a fairly small library here, <6000
titles, and the spine label is still the best way to find a book once I
have looked it up on the computer. Even someone who finds books by
browsing uses the spine label to find the right general area.
What if you don't have smart barcodes? Then what?
If you don't have spine labels, how do the students find the books?
That's the main reason we have them!
Hmmm, does this mean no spine label at all? How in the world will you
keep
things organized on the shelf? Yes, I'm a certified dinosaur!!!
In my library call numbers are essential for shelving the books and
locating them later. Barcodes are placed INSIDE the books -- this
wouldn't replace a call number in my book.
I guess I'm missing something but how would you shelve the books, by
reading the tiny print on the barcode???? If so, would you have to put
the barcode on the spine of the book? Sounds odd to me but then I'm a
dinosaur too!
You can put whatever you need and/or want on the barcode labels and on
the
spine labels. There isn't a "right" answer on this. Sometimes, you'll
see
the year of publication on a spine label which can be really helpful
depending on the research you're doing and it's great for weeding.
Sometimes you'll see the school's phone number on the barcode label
along
with the school's name so that if the book is lost it can be returned.
I
can't ever remember seeing "this is what must be on a label ... " in any
text. Rather, it has said "you might put ... " or "most institutions
add
... "
Follett is not the Great Guru of Cataloging, believe me! If their tech
staff is having difficulty with the amount of data, they need to remedy
the
problem by expanding their capacity. You're the customer; you're paying
the
bills; you need to get the service you paid for. If you need more
space,
they need to accommodate you, not the other way around.
And whoever said you and your fellow librarians were "out of touch" owes
you
a gigantic apology just on general principles!
Hi, Leslie,
I'm sorry; I must be missing something! How will patrons find the
wanted book/s if there are no spine labels? I don't know; I only
finished my degree (from an ALA accredited school) last December, but I
surely didn't learn that procedure! And, I don't care to say that I
don't like the sound of it.
The barcodes I can print from Follett's Destiny, which our county uses,
can include the author, title, call number, etc., but that still doesn't
help me shelve, since we place the barcode on the back of the book. It
is so small that I don't think spine placement of that barcode would
really help.
I'm not opposed to streamlining, but this doesn't sound like a good plan
to me.
Unless you're putting the barcode labels on the spine, I don't see how
you could do away with spine labels. How will you locate the books on
the shelf without pulling them out to check the barcode?
So, how do you find them easily on the shelf without spine labels? I
have to admit that I wouldn't mind the bar code on the spine if all the
info is readable but many books are thinner than the labels! (And my
last cataloging class was in 1999 so I'm SO last century I guess!)
Boy that doesn't make a lot of sense...no spine label? How will anyone
find them on the shelf???
Hello, Leslie,
Interesting question you pose. What about those of us who do not have
Destiny? What about those of us who still use dumb barcodes? I, too,
am a
REAL dinosaur as I have been doing this library work for over 40 years.
I suppose I am really out of touch! Maybe this is a way to move us (me)
out
the door - ta! ta!
Your OLD friend in the panhandle of Texas,
This makes no sense to me at all. In fact, I use larger spine labels
than
most libraries because I want the shelving/finding process to be as easy
as possible.
I have no idea how you can keep things organized without spine labels.
What I miss most about LC Is the unambiguity of the labeling. Each
label
is 100% unique, which facilitates both shelving and shelf organization.
Confused old fogie
Hi Leslie,
Could you tell us more about the logic of the idea that one doesn't need
spine labels any longer? I don't understand how bar codes, which are
never on the spines of the books, would take the place of the spine
labels.
Thanks,
Sue
Even if you do, I have trained my kids to shelve their own books. They
will not, and are not equipped to put away books with out some sort of
guidance, I see the spine labels as guides to the neighborhoods,
streets, and addresses of their books, so they can sleep in their own
beds at night. No spine labels, would mean I would have to shelve the
thousands of books that come in and out of the library every week. My
vote is no.
It is much easier to just do an hour or so of work every 6 weeks or so,
and a thorough clean twice a year, than to shelve all of those books. I
would never get all the rest done that I need and want to do for my
students and teachers. Plus, shelving allows real life practice of
skills needed in every day life.
just my 2 cents,
Hi, Leslie-
I would say that if the call numbers are large, clear and placed on
the spine, there would be no need to duplicate the information on the
barcode print-out. However, I have only seen the call numbers laid out
in a very small font size under the barcode, which I would find
inadequate, especially for visually limited students. It would be an
easy innovation for a service, like Mackin, or a programmer, like
I have wondered why barcodes have all that info. also. I don't think
the info. on barcodes is as important as the spine label. I use the
spine label to spot check the correct shelving of the books students
put back they don't want when they look for books and because they put
books away after turning them in (3, 4, 5 grades do this because I
can't keep up with the amount of books during a scheduled week of
classes. It also makes the turned in books available immediately to
classmates to check out.) How would you shelve a book if it didn't have
all the info. on it AND the spine label was not used?
Books don't need spine labels??? How are patrons supposed to find them -
pull each book out to look at the barcode? As for shelving them, the
spine
label is a lot easier than reading the call number from a barcode label
- or
are call numbers obsolete too? Seems strange to me
Unless the bar code is visible on the spine, how will you see the call
number quickly on the shelf to know if a book is in the correct place?
I might be a "dinosaur" but I still consider a call/spine sticker a
vital part of a library book. For thirteen years, I have taught
elementary students that the call sticker tells us where the book lives
in our library.
Isn't the purpose of the spine label is to help with finding and
shelving
books quicker?
And with no spine label, how will the patron be able to find the book on
the shelf? Pull out each book to read the barcode label? Somebody must
be very out of touch with how libraries are used. I don't see how this
is a Destiny issue. You can still print spine labels in Destiny (just
did it yesterday).
And will they also be issuing x-ray specs so that we can read the
barcode and know where the books should be/are on the shelf?
No spine label? how are you going to find the book on the shelf? Yes
the info is nice, but most of us use generic barcodes.
I thought spine labels were to help the patrons find the items??
The do help me shelve them faster + we don't use smart labels why
spend more for smart barcode labels
James Johnson
Perhaps I'm missing something, but if there's no spine label, how will
you know where to put the book on the shelf when you walk up and are
faced with rows and rows of blank spines? How will the patron know
where to find the book on the shelf? Are you suggesting putting the
barcodes on the spines? If so, I hope your barcodes are a lot bigger
than mine, because the call numbers are pretty tiny. And I assume the
barcodes would have to be put on the spines parallel to the title, which
makes all the call numbers sideways. That would be tough to eyeball
across a row of books. But if you wrapped the barcodes around the
spine, the reader couldn't read think books' barcodes.
Sorry, I just don't get how you'd do this.
Just one question -- without a spine label, where will you know where
books belong on the shelf? I think shelving would become horrendous
without spine labels. As it is, my student shelvers can make a royal
mess -- without spine labels, it would be much worse.
"VAN"
*******************************
Leslie Greaves Radloff, BS.Ed; MS.LME; MN History Curriculum Award
Winner;Book
Reviewer-Library Media Connection and others
Member: ALA/YALSA; MEMO; METRONET
Licensed Teacher Librarian
Maxfield Magnet School
380 N. Victoria Street
Saint Paul, MN 55104
651.293.8680 Ext.1134
651.293.5306 fax
leslie.radloff@spps.org
********************************
School libraries with licensed professionals equal higher student
achievement. Make school libraries a priority.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Please note: All LM_NET postings are protected by copyright law.
You can prevent most e-mail filters from deleting LM_NET postings
by adding LM_NET@LISTSERV.SYR.EDU to your e-mail address book.
To change your LM_NET status, you send a message to: listserv@listserv.syr.edu
In the message write EITHER:
1) SIGNOFF LM_NET
2) SET LM_NET NOMAIL
3) SET LM_NET MAIL
4) SET LM_NET DIGEST
* LM_NET Help & Information: http://lmnet.wordpress.com/
* LM_NET Archive: http://www.eduref.org/lm_net/archive/
* EL-Announce with LM_NET Select: http://lm-net.info/join.html
* LM_NET Supporters: http://lmnet.wordpress.com/category/links/el-announce/
--------------------------------------------------------------------
LM_NET
Mailing List Home