[LM_NET] HIT- Kindergarten very large group (second HIT, long)

[M S <drjesons@GMAIL.COM>]

This is my second HIT I want to thank all of you for sending suggestions.
The ideas I received have been very helpful. I AM NOT PUTTING THE EMAIL OR
INFORMATION OF THE Respondents as I am not sure if they want their private
information.

 Here are my request and the later responses to my request.

Hello and Happy New Year

I just started working in two different schools with kindergarten children.
In one school

I may get two classes together and I may have over 40 children at the time
with one or two assistants.

It is very hard to control the children as they fight and tease each other.
It gets warm in the classroom as they come at the end of the day with their
coats.

I have tried routines, breaking the lesson into several activities including
movement, finger play, songs, coloring and listening to a story.

They also have a routine about coming into the library, putting their coats
away,  and leaving.

I have them for 35 minutes. It seems that I waste about 15-20 minutes
settling them.

Any suggestions.?



Madeleine Zember

Kindergarten School Librarian

Hempstead NY

drjesons@gmail.com



Hi – I am trying to catch up with backlog of e-mail and read your Hit. Just
want to share something I got from LMNET a couple of years ago, which calms
down the K's when they arrive. I get them sitting and we do this little poem
together…. With appropriate actions:

On my head my hands I place

On my shoulders, on my face,

Then I reach them up so high, wave them gently in the sky,

Then I clap them – 1 – 2 – 3

Then I fold them quietly …

And we are ready for …

(whisper) our story.

They seem to love this for some reason – and it does settle them down.

I also have a poster "5 rules for good listening" -

Folded hands / lips sealed / eyes on me / ears listening / feet still. I
made it myself on a sheet of poster board and by each rule I drew a picture
of a story-book character i.e. Curious George's ear / Strega Nona with
folded hands etc.

Also with my First Grade I bought a little Shelf Elf from the Highsmith
catalog. The shelf elf keeps watch over the library and picks the person
with great library manners every week. They get a small prize (free book
from cereal packages, pencil, bookmark – or the chance to check out an extra
library book). This works very well and you might want to think about it for
getting them used to having to follow the rules.

Having given all this advice – my classes are much smaller (18 – 20) and my
heart goes out to you. I think divide and conquer is probably the best
plan….. but bribery often works well too!!!! Good luck – Ingrid



Dear Madeleine,
I am a former classroom teacher, and former school library media
specialist.  Though I am now working in a public library as a children's
librarian, I can certainly sympathize having been there.  I used to work
in Dallas in an elementary school of a little over 1,000 students.  I
had no clerk or library assistants.  Ninety-five percent of the student
population spoke Spanish as their first language, many spoke no English,
and I do no speak Spanish.  So, needless to say, there were challenges.


While I can't claim to have the answers to all of your problems, I can
share something that an experienced teacher shared with me when I
started teaching, and it is simply incredible how well this works.  This
is gold!  If it doesn't work for this situation, keep it in mind for the
future.

It's the Silent Star.  At the end of the day when it is time to get
ready to go home, you put a star on the board (or put one up somewhere
if you don't have a white board).  Upon seeing the star the students
know that they are no longer allowed to talk to each other or to you.
They do the things they have to do to get ready to go (get their coats,
lunch boxes, homework, backbacks, push in their chairs, check the floor
for garbage, etc.).  You do not answer questions during this time, and
there will be kids trying to get your attention.  If anyone talks,
everyone goes back to starting positions.  You must be firm (not harsh)
and consistent.  It does take a while to learn this.  You will have to
make them practice, practice, practice right at first so they get the
hang of it.  After everyone is standing silently behind their desks
ready to go, you can then break the silence by asking if there are any
questions.  Hands go up.  You answer a question once, maybe twice,
rather than 40 times.  Praising them when they do it right is crucial.
You want a positive environment.

Now, I don't know about your situation specifically, but taking talking
out of the equation reduces the chaos level dramatically.  You may have
to sprinkle imaginary fairy dust on them to help them stay silent during
the Silent Star time.  I saw an experienced first grade teacher do that
when I was considering becoming a teacher.  It was magical.  :)

I don't know if any of this will help, but I hope it does.  Hang in
there.  :)

Best of luck,

Bea


***********************

I would tackle this issue as a safety concern.  Go on record, via e-mail so
there is record of your concerns for children's safety.  Then if anything
does occur later, they will be the ones who look remiss.

Here's what I've learned:
Create a routine and teach each step of it.  Have different kids
model what it looks like, have kids tell you what it is as you
demonstrate.  I have a sign with eyes, ears and finger to mouth (I
need eyes up here, ears listening, mouth quiet before I can read the
story.  Oh, all the kids up here are ready, yes, you and you are
ready.  Show me what this looks like, show me what it sounds like.  I
need this so I can read."  It took me a long time to learn it, but
finally when kids are wiggly or distracted, I comment on all the kids
who are doing it right, making eye contact.  Everyone wants to be
noticed, they all sit quickly.  Have a coming in song, a get-set
finger play, a transition song.  I have one I made up, "Put your
bottom on the rug, on the rug (tap on the rug, tap), put your bottom
on the rug, on the rug (tap, tap) put your bottom on the rug and give
yourself a hug, put your bottom on the rug, on the rug."  I spend the
first 4-6 weeks just teaching the routine.  Do they take books our or
just come for story?  finger play and movement songs are essential.
Have ones you do every time that become routine transitions.  35
minutes is a long time!  I have mine for 20 min and sometimes that is
long.
I am still teaching the taking out book routine, each time they come,
having them model, having them tell me what to do as I model.  I
choose a book, then what do I do?  Sit down and look at it?  Can I
sit here?  Why not?  Oh, yes, I'm in the way of the other kids who
want to look at these books.  I need to move somewhere else.  Ok, now
what do I do?  I look at the book?  oh, yes, so I know it is one I
want.  and now?  I got up to the picture of the lion (they "lion' up
at the lion, some get it, most don't)...etc etc.   Keep trying to see
what works best.  Get the K teachers to tell you what works for them.
Use the signals that their teachers use.  I start with audience
participation stories, like Caps for Sale (kids are monkeys)





I don't have a solution for you now, but my suggestion is to ask
administration (or if you have this power) to change your K kids time so
they don't come at the end of the day.

With your assistant, can you split the group in two or three and have
her/him do one thing while you do another?  Then maybe only twenty kids at a
time would be more manageable.  While I am not a big fan of videos, maybe
half could do that for some of the lessons (most kids will attend to them).
 The other thing is just to tell the kids to stop fighting, teasing or they
have to put their heads down and don't get books or lessons and the
assistant can be the "police officer".  The circumstance is sad and what
makes it worse is that those kids are learning as K kids that they can
misbehave in the library, so you might end up dealing with this behavior the
whole time they go through the grades.  A principal should be able to
understand that!
Theresa



I feel for you I have 32 kindergarteners from 3 different rooms at the same
time.  I have them first thing in the morning and I have to go get them and
bring them down the hall from the other end of the building.  I have them
for 30 minutes and take them back and then get another group of 32 from 3
different rooms with at least a couple of special ed kids in each group.  I
feel like I finally have a routine going, now that we are half way through
school.  I felt like many times I was a real gripe, but at least now it has
gotten better.
 **********************

Madeline,

We have large kinder groups here and though I have only one class at a time,
it may be as many as 32 children sitting together in a small space on the
rug. We allot 30 minutes for the class but usually spend slightly less. I do
an opening to settle them, read one or two stories, then have them check out
if the teacher desires it. The books do not go home, so the teacher checks
them out at the circ desk under her name while I and her aide supervise and
guide them to the checkout line. I don't do crafts, although occasionally we
do a finger play before or after the story, and talk about book care and
page turning (no "mashing") - this is plenty for their attention span.

If I have a student disrupt, I ask them if they want to behave appropriately
and remain with the group, or sit by the doorway (where they cannot see the
pictures). It's their choice and they get only one chance to improve their
behavior – the teachers always back me up, in fact, they are usually more
strict than I am. If I remember, we do a song before leaving. Before the
class comes, I pull a selection of books and lay them out on a table. I
dismiss the kids a few at a time to get books from the table. Save much
wear-and-tear on the books not being shoved in and out of the shelves or
bins. Limits their selection to a reasonable amount (too many choices are
overwhelming and can create chaos), and they like selecting by seeing the
covers (spines mean noting to them since they can't read yet).

I look over the sitting class and call out different groups one at a time –
everybody with buttons, with pony tails, with necklaces (even boys have
those now), with Velcro shoes, etc. a few minutes apart. The aide helps
assist at the table so there's no arguing. If I have two kids argue over a
book, I simply take the book and put it away so no one gets it. Ends arguing
promptly.

I would strongly recommend that you discuss with the teachers, and then with
the principal if necessary, the need to limit the time block to one class.
The teachers, as well as the aides, should be there if you have two classes.
Since I am not credentialed, state ed code in California mandates the
teacher's presence, not merely her aide, when the class is here with me.
Check with your principal on this – it is a matter of the children's safety.

Madeline,



If the teachers cannot come, then find out if there are several moms (or
grandmas) who could be helpers. I was at one school that had such a fabulous
PTA they had a volunteer parent for every class to assist me. This was
before automation, so writing up list of late books took a lot of my time.
If you can get the moms, ask them to come in 10 minutes ahead and help you
get the books spread out nicely on the table. I start with my "A" author
picture books in Sept. and gradually work through the alphabet. This exposes
them to a variety of authors and cover illustrations. What's really great is
that all the returns go back quickly on the picture book shelf since they
are usually all from one or two (author) letters.

Today when I had them, I had to read two books, so mid-way I had them get up
(in place) and stretch. We reached for the ceiling, down to our toes, then
wiggled our hips and shook our hands, then sat. Sort of like the 7th inning
stretch at baseball games. They really liked it. Then after they checked
out, some of them "finished" their books before it was time to go. I thought
fast and had them "reread" the book and look for letter A. In the past, I've
also had them look for something red, a square shape, etc. You could
actually call this the Treasure Hunt game. You could have a little bell and
ring it once a minute, announcing a new treasure to look for. One day you
could work with them on the parts of a book (front cover, back cover, spine,
spine label, title page, barcode). We do have to have them work on finding
the school barcode rather than the book code since our checkout barcode is
also on the back (ours is at the top). This is so helpful to know because
when they return the books, they can make a stack with the barcode at the
top, and that speeds up check-in.

Since you are often alone, perhaps you might want to ask the principal to
come and visit/assist when you have two classes, so s/he can see that you do
need help. Just a thought.


Thanks to All of you again and God Bless You

Madeline Zember

Kindergarten Librarian

Hempstead NY

drjesons@gmail.com

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