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Here is even more on the subject... Kimberly Rose Library Media Specialist Star Lake Elementary Kent, WA Federal Way S.D. krose@fwsd.wednet.edu ************************************* I'd opt for the cafeteria as opposed to the library. I'm the glorified after school babysitter/librarian for our high school, and it hasn't worked out(my opinion) because students aren't studying-they're getting on illegal web sites, getting in the stacks to eat, etc. I know you're probably talking about younger kids in your case, but you have to think about the food issue(snacks or breakfast for after/before school care), books walking away with caregivers or children, and more work for you straightening shelves,etc. Do you really want this aggravation? Talk to your principal and bring up some of your concerns. Hope this helps. ************************************* Our program takes place in the cafeteria. ************************************* Some questions you should ask - politely and with a smile of course: who's going to supervise what will student's do there will food be served will any library materials be used who will be responsible for damage or loss if the room is rearranged will it be put back where will students put coats and other stuff We run an after school program - in 2 first floor classrooms - with immediate access to the outside for easy pick-up and going to the playground. My library is generally open after school. ************************************* NO, NO, NO! It was proposed for my PK-2 library and the principal said No Way. The program was then housed in the school cafeteria. The kids walked on the tables, wrote on the walls, you name it. They did so much damage there that we all shuddered to think what they might have "accomplished" in the library! ************************************* I've experienced before/after care in the library at both places I've worked and I HATE IT! Fight it all you can!!! I must say it's not so bad now, but I get tired of having to straighten my place up every day. Just yesterday I cleaned up poptart crumbs from all around the computer--guess who was having breakfast? The thing that really irks me I guess is not having control of my space. Do any other teachers have to share their classrooms? No, they set up for the next day, leave and go home, and everything is set to go the next morning. Not ever so for me. Okay, I'll step down from my soapbox now. : ) ************************************* Sure. Happily agree--with the understanding that it will be also perfectly reasonable to expect to use the principal's office, after hours, for aerobics classes or skateboarding or ??? And, hey, why DON'T they pack peas and peaches in the same can, as the space is there and the economic benefit is evident... . Don't forget to suggest the toilets in the school's restrooms might be used to keep folks' goldfish, when they are not otherwise being "used." And why DO we waste space and resources with bookends, when we could fill up each and every shelf, after all??? Seriously, try to keep it light, but this really IS (or should be) a no-brainer. Gotta go. I'm heading off to the bank to pick up a rifle and some donuts... . ************************************* We have before and after care in our building. When the cafeteria, their usual space is being used (occurs about three times a month) the media center becomes their space. I find it VERY unpleasant. The students are not controlled well. The noise level is untolerable...and I don't keep a quiet library. I know I can forget getting any shelving done or any other work in the main media center. Even in my office with the door closed, it's irritating. The media center is also used weekly for girl scouts (not much better than daycare) and for chess club for an 8 week period. That's why I get to work at 7:00 for a school day that begins at 8:35! ************************************* What ages & what do they mean by "child care". Are we talking a very structured program or just one of those "stick the kids in front of the VCR" deals? And are we talking 4 year olds or 10 year olds? I run an informal one in my library in the morning - it's from 7-7:30. Since it's mine and I do it for free, I get to set the rules! I limit it to high AR point pass 5th graders and a few others who need help with their homework or can work independently. They read, do homework, socialize, use the computers etc. If they misbehave they have to go back to the cafeteria to wait-which they hate so they are usually pretty good. We have a more formal after school program for 3, 4 & 5th graders - it's mostly homework help. The problem with using the library is that some folks figure "the kids can just read". This works fine with older kids who like to read, it's a disaster if you have 6 year olds who can't. Tell whomever is proposing the program that you need more details before you will commit- specifically ages food - will the kids be eating? activities - are we talking homework help or finger paint? who is responsible for kids who aren't picked up on time (it will happen) ************************************* My public K-5 elementary school offers school-age child care in our gym both before and after school. The after school program has a homework session that I have permitted to take place in my library. My rules are that the group must be there for quiet study only and that they must be strictly supervised by one of the after school care-givers. The after school time is the only time that I have to work quietly in my library on my paperwork and since I do not have a private office I am not able to lock myself in a separate room away from the students. I have made it clear to all involved that I am not the students' supervisor nor am I there to chat with the children or help with homework. Students are able to use all of the library's print materials but not the computers (my reasoning is that I would be continuously sought out for computer assistance if the children were using them.) I also have had to reinforce with the students and the care-givers that I expect the library chairs and tables to be left tidy. I do not tolerate chairs left askew or bits of paper or eraser crumbs to be left scattered on the tables. My principal is very supportive of my stance and even had the after-school program get my permission before allowing the homework session to take place in the library. I do not think an after-school childcare program housed solely in the library will work. By the time the school bell rings the kids are naturally ready to get rowdy, wiggle around and throw off school rules. They need to do this after a full day at school. You won't be able to get any of your work done quietly and the children participating in the after school care program will confuse after school library behavior and in school library behavior. Also, unless you set strict rules, you will get sucked into assisting with their care. Gosh, after reading what I've written I sound like a real nasty, old-fashion librarian! Truly, I love my school kids and I know that I am one of their favorites in the school. That's why I have had to set up strict rules, otherwise my little darlings would continually be seeking me out for some loving attention. ************************************* I have a before school program in my library. The library is open from 7:30 - 8:00. Class starts at 8:00. I have the grade levels assigned to a day. Monday = 5th, Tuesday = 4th, etc. Friday = 1st. I didn't include Kindergarten because this was a new thing this year and I didn't know how it would work. It has been great! The kids come in on their day ready to go. Most go to the computer and play educational games or work on class assignments that require typing or research. Some play UNO or Battleship. Sometimes I have crafts out also. It doesn't sound like you will be able to break it up by grade level, but I thought that I would share. ************************************* We have approx. 70-80 children in the library for supervision every morning before school. They are the children that do not ride a bus or eat breakfast. It is an unstructured time as the kids are arriving in steady intervals. Some children read or are read to by older students, we have some games etc. for them to play. We have also had students supervised by a YMCA after school daycare program when they cannot use the gym or cafeteria. Generally, they watch movies. The morning kids are supervised by the library staff, but the Y kids have supervisors. We also supervise after school tutoring kids two days a week until they are picked up by their teachers. Usually 15 minutes or so. My question to you is who will be expected to supervise them? If you are, I would ask for extra pay! =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-==-= All postings to LM_NET are protected under copyright law. To quit LM_NET (or set-reset NOMAIL or DIGEST, etc.) send email to: listserv@listserv.syr.edu In the message write EITHER: 1) SIGNOFF LM_NET 2) SET LM_NET NOMAIL or 3) SET LM_NET DIGEST 4) SET LM_NET MAIL * Please allow for confirmation from Listserv. 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